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Charlie Hansen and Finn Harkin discuss PHONEY
Theatre can open doors to worlds and experiences far removed from our own. It can inform and enlighten, as well as entertain. By doing so, theatre can break down barriers, open minds, and sometimes be a catalyst for change.
Charlie Hansen and Finn Harkin discuss about using their lived experiences as a sex worker and trans man, in creating their new show PHONEY, premiering at the Bread & Roses Theatre this week, along with their hopes for its impact.
Welcome to you both, why don’t you introduce yourselves.
Hello! We are Charlie Hansen & Finn Harkin, co-creators of PHONEY. Together we have written, produced, self-directed, and acted in this play. As best friends of six years, we consider the project our platonic child and are very excited for you all to meet them!
Where will we find the show then?
We wanted a piece that has such a visceral connection to us to be performed in an intimate space. We also chose the Bread & Roses Theatre as they work on a profit-share basis with no upfront fees, which is ideal for us as we have no funding – and we are grateful to the Bread & Roses Theatre for running on this business model, as it means theatre-making is more accessible.
What was the inspiration behind the show?
The idea for PHONEY was sparked by Finn hearing Charlie talk about their experiences with phone sex work and thinking about how he would feel doing that work as a trans man. From that, the idea of creating a play about a trans man doing phone sex became very stuck in Finn’s mind. He sat on the idea for a couple of years before finding the right time and the perfect co-creator (which, of course, had to be Charlie!)
How long have you been working on this play?
PHONEY originally began as a five-minute scratch piece created by Finn at East 15 Acting School in spring 2023, which was later extended into a 15-minute script in summer 2023. Charlie came on board in early 2024, and together we developed it into an hour-long play.
Is the version coming to the The Bread and Roses Theatre how you originally envisioned it, or has it changed drastically since you first put pen to paper?
When PHONEY was originally conceived by Finn, it focused more on the trans experience. When Charlie joined, the realities of being a sex worker were added in detail.
You have a personal connection to the characters you play, tell us more.
Given our lived experience in these marginalised groups, we wanted to bring these realities to the stage and ensure these perspectives were given due time and acknowledgement.
What is it about your characters that you most enjoy?
We’ve both enjoyed getting to play characters that are essentially extreme versions of ourselves – the friendship dynamic definitely has some truth but is taken to its furthest possible outcome!
How challenging has this role been for you?
Due to the content of the play, the roles have definitely brought up some challenging feelings for us both about the experiences we’ve had. We’ve ensured that we keep communication open and honest to make sure we’re always looking after each other, and ourselves.
What is it you hope the audience thinks after watching the show?
We hope it will lead audiences to consider more thoroughly the lived realities of trans and non-binary people. We were both keen to highlight that Raphie and Em are, in fact, very happy with who they are. It is the outside influences (e.g. inaccessibility of gender affirming care; ignorance from friends and family) that causes them struggle, not their gender identities inherently. We also wanted to humanise trans people and sex workers – having both been in these groups, we know they are often stereotyped and stigmatised.
Who do you imagine enjoying the show the most?
We hope that the show will resonate with gender non-conforming people and sex workers who can relate to the experiences that we bring to life. However, we also hope that it will prove illuminating to people outside these groups who may not have considered some of the issues raised.
Is this going to be the show’s first time on stage?
This is the first time that PHONEY will be performed, and we are very excited to introduce Raphie and Em to everyone. We hope to gain funding after this run in order to bring this important narrative to a wider audience.
Is there one question we really should have asked you already?
One question that we quite often get is, “How much of the sex work is real?” All the clients and calls, bar two of the briefer references, are based on specific people/calls that Charlie had while working in the industry. Life really is stranger than fiction!
Will people find you in the bar after your show to ask questions?
Yes, we would love people to chat to us about the play and its themes! We hope that the piece will provoke lots of discussion, both immediately afterwards and going forward. Given the piece is only an hour long, there is plenty we have not been able to include in terms of the experiences of trans people and sex workers; we would love to delve further in person.
If you could perform this show anywhere in the world, where would it be and why?
The House of Commons – perhaps then we might actually see some positive change in the laws towards trans people and sex workers (we can dream).
Thank you to Charlie and Finn for taking the time to talk to us. PHONEY will play at the Bread and Roses Theatre between 10th and 14th September. Further information and tickets available here.
